In this podcast, our friends at the Tax Justice Network speak with two journalists who got the Panama Papers scoop, Bastian Obermayer and Frederik Obermaier who've written a book about their experience.

Plus, what does tax justice mean post-Brexit? The podcast looks at F4, the (unholy) alliance between Switzerland, Hong Kong, Singapore and the UK, and the accelerated corporate tax race to the bottom.

'Unfortunately there is the world people like you and me are living in and there is a second world, a parallel world, the offshore world where people with enough money will always find possibilities to hide their money...there are people out there choosing which law they want to stick to and that is a problem for democracy,' explains Obermaier.

'I am very clear about what would happen if you take away the secrecy, if you take away the anonymity. I am completely sure that the whole system would crash because why would they go to the British Virgin Islands for a company when you can see who owns it? You know, it's not rocket science.'

Post-Brexit: 'I think that Britain's likely development strategy will be to actually deepen its tax haven role sitting offshore Europe,' says John Christensen from the Tax Justice Network.

This episode is produced and presented by Naomi Fowler.